British Ordnance Collectors Network
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Proposed Ban by European Commission to include everything collected by BOCN members?
- Thread starter bdgreen
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Wont the damage have been done by then?
I wish we had also a choice in Holland, stay in or go out like England we all know the result, I hope the UK is wise and vote out, and lets hope when the UK votes out it will be the start that more countries will go out. Ben
The regulations will come in force very soon, before UK possibly votes themselves out from UE. It may take many years before any other UE members are out, and when these regulations have already been long time in force, I don't think it's easy to get the "good old days" back - unfortunately.
About Finland, we had with Russia about 25% of our export. After the EU economical limitations against Russia we have suffered much more than many other EU countries. Now mr. Putler is sending refugees to Finland, though we have had years a contract that Russia that they should not send anybody to Finland without necessary documents.
If EU breaks, I guess the next step is in Finland what happened in Krim.
Thus, I hope the EU will remain completely, in any case.
About Finland, we had with Russia about 25% of our export. After the EU economical limitations against Russia we have suffered much more than many other EU countries. Now mr. Putler is sending refugees to Finland, though we have had years a contract that Russia that they should not send anybody to Finland without necessary documents.
If EU breaks, I guess the next step is in Finland what happened in Krim.
Thus, I hope the EU will remain completely, in any case.
Just read an amendment which will affect us I think?
Amendment 54
(-8) Article 10 is replaced by thefollowing:
"Article 10The arrangements for the acquisition and possession of ammunition shall be the same as those for the possession of the firearms for which the ammunition is intended. The acquisition and possession of ammunition shall be allowed only by persons who are allowed to possess a firearm."
Whole document here;
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides.../NONSGML+COMPARL+PE-578.822+01+DOC+PDF+V0//EN
C.
Amendment 54
(-8) Article 10 is replaced by thefollowing:
"Article 10The arrangements for the acquisition and possession of ammunition shall be the same as those for the possession of the firearms for which the ammunition is intended. The acquisition and possession of ammunition shall be allowed only by persons who are allowed to possess a firearm."
Whole document here;
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides.../NONSGML+COMPARL+PE-578.822+01+DOC+PDF+V0//EN
C.
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pzgr40
Well-Known Member
Let's just wait instead of making one another crazy with possible regulations. We've all signed the petition, so all we can do is wait.
Looking for the definition of ammunition on the internet one finds:
Ammunition (commonly shortened to ammo) is propellant and projectile, or broadly anything that can be used in combat including bombs, missiles, warheads, landmines, naval mines, and anti-personnel mines. The word comes from the French la munition which is all material used for war. The collective term for all types of ammunition is munitions
So, in fact we do not collect ammunition , as all the stuff we collect does not contain energetic substances anymore and is not suitable to be used as ammunition in combat in any way, exept for when dropping it on someone's foot. We collect military artifacts, either scrap metal.
Looking for the definition of ammunition on the internet one finds:
Ammunition (commonly shortened to ammo) is propellant and projectile, or broadly anything that can be used in combat including bombs, missiles, warheads, landmines, naval mines, and anti-personnel mines. The word comes from the French la munition which is all material used for war. The collective term for all types of ammunition is munitions
So, in fact we do not collect ammunition , as all the stuff we collect does not contain energetic substances anymore and is not suitable to be used as ammunition in combat in any way, exept for when dropping it on someone's foot. We collect military artifacts, either scrap metal.
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Hi Pzgr40,
I think you'll find there are quite a few on here that collect live on ticket that do contain energetic substances and as a recent amendment to the proposed regulations that effects said collectors thought it was quite pertinent to our collective interest.
I'm actually now at a loss of what to write. I'd of thought everyone with the slightest interest in the proposed regulations would want to know the current situation as it's amazing how one little amendment can have dramatic unseen consequences across other areas.
If you want to wait in a darkened room going crazy then that's up to you. Its ok, you signed the petition! May I recommend a more proactive angle that may be of benefit to our hobby a little more, like spending a minute to compose a polite letter to Vicky Ford who wrote the amendments pointing out how that amendment could affect collectors rather than shooting me down for trying to keep like minded people informed with whats going on.
C.
I think you'll find there are quite a few on here that collect live on ticket that do contain energetic substances and as a recent amendment to the proposed regulations that effects said collectors thought it was quite pertinent to our collective interest.
I'm actually now at a loss of what to write. I'd of thought everyone with the slightest interest in the proposed regulations would want to know the current situation as it's amazing how one little amendment can have dramatic unseen consequences across other areas.
If you want to wait in a darkened room going crazy then that's up to you. Its ok, you signed the petition! May I recommend a more proactive angle that may be of benefit to our hobby a little more, like spending a minute to compose a polite letter to Vicky Ford who wrote the amendments pointing out how that amendment could affect collectors rather than shooting me down for trying to keep like minded people informed with whats going on.
C.imaokie2000
Well-Known Member
Signed - Sick of it too............
pzgr40
Well-Known Member
Hi Charlie,
Do not misunderstand me, I am absolutely on the side of the colletors. This "EU" we live in however is a undeniable force in which the bigger countries with the most voting power descide our lives.
Looking at the last amendments however, a window is created (amendment 49), which states:
"-Member States may choose to grant strictly limited authorisations to legal or natural persons dedicated to the gathering, study and conservation of firearms and associated artefacts for historical, cultural, scientific, technical,educational, aesthetic or heritage purposes and recognised as such by the Member State in whose territory they are for firearms and ammunition classified in category A, provided that such persons demonstrate that measures are in place to address any risks to public security or public order and that thefire arm or firearms concerned are stored with a level of security proportionate to the risks associated with unauthorised access to such firearms."
I think one can consider ammunition as the "associated artefacts"
This will probably mean that there will be a licencing system in the near future like we have in the Netherlands; you'll be able to get a collectors licence if you're a member of the ECRA (ammunition collectors club) , have no serious criminal record, and are mentaly stable.
A licencing system for collectors would stangely enough create more future stability for collectors; do not forget that in many European countries collecting -especially military- ammo is absolutely illegal, but turned a blind eye on as long as there are no complaints. What happens if the blind eye is suddenly not turned away anymore one can now see in Belgium; two years ago absolutely everything was possible, about a year ago suddenly even fired shellcases were illegal and confiscated.
Same for the USA of which most people think everything is allowed; collecting military ammunition is forbidden (destructive devices), but as long as no complaints are made authorities turn a blind eye, at the first complaint however everything is confiscated.
Do not misunderstand me, I am absolutely on the side of the colletors. This "EU" we live in however is a undeniable force in which the bigger countries with the most voting power descide our lives.
Looking at the last amendments however, a window is created (amendment 49), which states:
"-Member States may choose to grant strictly limited authorisations to legal or natural persons dedicated to the gathering, study and conservation of firearms and associated artefacts for historical, cultural, scientific, technical,educational, aesthetic or heritage purposes and recognised as such by the Member State in whose territory they are for firearms and ammunition classified in category A, provided that such persons demonstrate that measures are in place to address any risks to public security or public order and that thefire arm or firearms concerned are stored with a level of security proportionate to the risks associated with unauthorised access to such firearms."
I think one can consider ammunition as the "associated artefacts"
This will probably mean that there will be a licencing system in the near future like we have in the Netherlands; you'll be able to get a collectors licence if you're a member of the ECRA (ammunition collectors club) , have no serious criminal record, and are mentaly stable.
A licencing system for collectors would stangely enough create more future stability for collectors; do not forget that in many European countries collecting -especially military- ammo is absolutely illegal, but turned a blind eye on as long as there are no complaints. What happens if the blind eye is suddenly not turned away anymore one can now see in Belgium; two years ago absolutely everything was possible, about a year ago suddenly even fired shellcases were illegal and confiscated.
Same for the USA of which most people think everything is allowed; collecting military ammunition is forbidden (destructive devices), but as long as no complaints are made authorities turn a blind eye, at the first complaint however everything is confiscated.
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A colleague of mine recently said to me that he did not know enough about the EU debate to make an informed decision on whether the UK should be in or leave. Neither did I, so to try to make myself more aware I read a book by David Charter: Europe: In or out? Everything you need to know, ISBN 9781849546843, price £8.99. If you are concerned enough not to leave it to biased people to try to sway you, then I would recommend reading it. The screed on the back says that it is unbiased and objective and that Charter spent five years in Brussels as the Europe correspondent of The Times newspaper. It was written in a way that I could understand and explained some of the terms used. It also gave relevant facts and pros and cons. Although he openly states his preference, Charter leaves the reader to decide for themselves.
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Rather late but signed.
Will be voting OUT in June. I am thoroughly sick of the EU. I feel like I'm being oppressed. What did most of my family fight in WW1 and WW2 for?
Our basic freedoms are being eroded because the politicians are afraid to confront Islam, which is the root cause of all this.
I think I'll go and buy a cabin in Montana.
John
Will be voting OUT in June. I am thoroughly sick of the EU. I feel like I'm being oppressed. What did most of my family fight in WW1 and WW2 for?
Our basic freedoms are being eroded because the politicians are afraid to confront Islam, which is the root cause of all this.
I think I'll go and buy a cabin in Montana.
John
Whilst the immigration issue is obviously important I personally don't think it's the main problem in this debate . From the purely fiscal point of view the EU is doomed . The currency doesn't work in the modern world & the emphasis on ever increasing bureaucracy is self defeating . A good example is the steel manufacturing problem . This is by no means just the fault of the EU as the UK government has been equally complicit in compounding the troubles by signing up to totally unrealistic "carbon" taxes that make it unviable . If ever there was a need to make an exception for state intervention [& these would be VERY few] , steel is the one . With our somewhat difficult relationship at times over the last few hundred years or so with a few of our neighbours I think you probably need a steel industry more than , say , parking wardens . Steel is just one example . We could mention many more . Although not a specific EU issue , there is , of course , the Human Rights Act enshrined in EU dogma . A fine & worthy piece of legislation when proposed at the end of WW2 but now hijacked by every low life bottom feeding legal firm to either line their own pockets or make ideological left wing points .
Vote out for the sake of our grand children . It may not be easy at first but in the long term freedom over oppression has always been the answer .
John , Montana is probably fabulous but I'll take my chances in Kent & all the other glorious English counties !
Mike
Vote out for the sake of our grand children . It may not be easy at first but in the long term freedom over oppression has always been the answer .
John , Montana is probably fabulous but I'll take my chances in Kent & all the other glorious English counties !
Mike
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