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German WW2 Signal Pistol Cartridges

K

khanmak

Well-Known Member
Hi All,
I am trying to identify x2 german Signal pistol cartridges. Investigations so far with the information I have have not led to a positive (or anything near) ID. Both cases originate from a German WW2 vehicle and both were live when the vehicle was destroyed (presumably by fire as both rounds appear to have "cooked off"). Looking through my notes, as per most German ammunition types, there is a dazzling array of different types!

Photos attached but description follows

CASE 1 - 135mm long blue band around case near base
markings as per photo (manufacturer & "best before" date only not type!), Case base rim roughly milled half way round - marked by blue ring on base.
case1.jpg
Case 2 - 83mm long blue band around case near base.
No identifiable markings as to badly burned.Case base rim roughly milled all way round
case2.jpg

Thanks For looking!
Mark
 
Hi Blackwatch
Many thanks for your ID. Do you have any idea of the use of the R-Patrone and the significance of the Model 2. I have an American 1945 manual that seems to indicate that it is an r-Pareone, as well. Do you have the reference that you ID'd the cartridge from - I'm hoping to write this up into an archaeological piece so be good to incude this.
I had a look at your website - fascinating work! I live in the UK near Worthing so was particularly interested in the Flying Officer Wheatley Piece!
Many Thanks Again!
Mark
Ps - did try to PM you - not sure if the message got sent, cant seem to find it in my sent items anywhere!
 
If a R-Patrone the band around case cant be blue, must be grey. Model 2 is because the case is made of aluminium, model 1 case is made of cardboard with metal base. And it was used for Smoke, Rauch=Smoke. The second case it is impossible to id, it could be anything.
 
Hi khanmak,
the first one is really a R-Patrone. Okay - the band around case must be grey. This color is often a blue - grey (in german: blaugrau). A dark blue band is on the Pfeifpatrone (whistling cartridge), but the name "Pfeifpatrone" is written on the cartridge case. The name "Rauchpatrone" is not written on the case. The rim is roughly milled half way round. This is the code for a white (or yellow) light. Whistling cartridges have a plain rim. The R - Patrone is a simulator for projectiile air - burst. There is a loud sound, a white flashlight
and a greyisch cloud of smoke.
The second cartridge is a single star cartridge (lenght: 83mm), the rim totally milled, that means: red light. If the rim is plain - green light, if the rim is half milled - white or yellow light.
i hope, this helps
Horst
 
No, my name is Horst, but I've also written a book about German signal cartridges.

Regards Horst
 
Excellent - thanks guys! BOCN comes up trumps again!

Horst - how can I get a copy of your book?

Mark
 
Hi,
here is my book about German cartridges in caliber 4. It contains the German Empire from 1894, the Weimar Republic, the Third Reich, the German Democratic Republic and the U (1).jpgAdolf.jpgErich.jpg
Federal Republic of Germany. The price is 51 . If interested, send me a PM.
Regards Horst
 
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