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.50" mg round

J

Jimiles

Well-Known Member
I've posted this on the IAA forum but got no response at all so any help at all would be appreciated.
This corroded casing was picked up recently in a Norfolk field in an area where .50 BMG cases & rounds are regularly found. It's pictured alongside a regular .50 BMG round for comparison - and which was found in the same area.
I'm guessing it's .50" in calibre but the neck has been crushed and distorted. It has a caselength of 70mm.
It has a Twin Cities headstamp - in case it doesn't show clearly in the picture it's 'T W 4 3'.
Any ideas?
Relic.jpg


Sidebyside.jpg


headstamp-1.jpg
 
MissingSomething said:
looks like a .50 spotter cartridge.

12.7x76
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I think you are spot on misingsomething but what the heck would it have been used on/in/for???

The only ones i have seen were all for the Wombat 120mm RCL spotting weapon which used the M48A1 rounds-also what are those small drilled holes for?

More questions than answers I am afraid.
 
The M48 Spotter cartridge was my first thought but it's 6mm too short, the extractor groove is unusually narrow....and 1943 seems too early. It's possible that the small holes are the result of corrosion but they seem a little too regular to me.
 
Well spoted Jimiles !

Jimiles said:
The M48 Spotter cartridge was my first thought but it's 6mm too short, the extractor groove is unusually narrow....and 1943 seems too early. It's possible that the small holes are the result of corrosion but they seem a little too regular to me.
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Very well spotted Jimiles, I had completely missed that small extractor groove-yes it is indeed very small, much smaller than I have seen on other 50 cal cases?????
The holes are also too regular and round to be corrosion but may well have been to hold a projectile as well as a crimp.:hmmmm2:
The plot thickens as they say.
 
Accurate measurements are difficult because of the layer of corrosion but the rim diameter is 20.1mm, pretty much the same as the .50BMG pictured beside it. The rim thickness is 1.9mm and the extractor groove is 1.3mm. The casehead to the shoulder is about 50.4mm.
.50" cartridges are out of my collecting sphere but I've noticed that the date is headstamped at 12 o'clock whilst the 'TW' is at 6 o'clock; strikes me as an unusual configuration or is this normal for Twin Cities?
 
Just a thought but does anybody know if the U.S. every manufactured .5" Vickers ammunition for the U.K. during WW2?

Tony
 
It is definitely not a .5 Vickers. The .5 Vickers had a much smaller base diameter.

There was some .50 Vickers made in Canada at the Dominion Three Rivers factory in Quebec. These are headstamped "TR" at the top with a two digit date at the bottom. They are apparently quite rare nowadays. I haven't ever actually seen one, just a photo of a headstamp.
 
Could it be a vent tube?

There is nothing in any of the de Heks I have that is even remotely similar.
 
I forwarded this enquiry to Bill Woodin & Frank Hackley for their expert opinions. Sadly both concluded that this is not a legitimate military cartridge and they suspect it was most likely made up for perhaps a board display, some sort of souvenir, trench art, ornament, etc.
The base & headstamp would appear to be that of a genuine .50" Browning machine gun case but I don't quite see how it ever left the factory as such with it's very narrow extractor groove. Increasing the width of the extractor groove with a lathe or similar would have been quite straight forward but I don't understand how anybody could have reduced it's width - which is what appears to have happened with this round. Confused!
Jim
 
Just my tuppence worth.Has the case been shortened and fitted back on to a machined down rim? The groove doesnt look parallel all round. The only way to tell though would to be remove the corrosion around the rim, unless you can clean the inside of the case and look for any anomalities. Pouring hot water in to the case might show up any gaps where they shouldnt be if you can't clean the inside.
Hangarman
 
Hi, is it possible that it could be one of these lighters.
Andy
 

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I reckon Andys correct, I've seen alot of unfinished .50 cal cigarette lighters discarded when somthing went wrong. I bet, as mentioned you will find the case has been shortened and reattched to the base. I would bet that the holes in the rim have somthing to do with the fuel/gas.
 
Andy,
I'd say you're absolutely spot on - your lighter certainly matches my case regarding the rim width and the two holes in the neck. Thank you!
Jim
 
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